Beyond the Game: Wealth Mastery for Athletes

E10: Learning Financial Strategies from 11-Year NBA Vet Anthony Tolliver

In this episode of Beyond the Game, Kris Benson and Alec Ogletree dive into a wide-ranging conversation with 11-year NBA veteran Anthony Tolliver about his journey to the NBA, managing expectations both on and off the court, and the financial strategies he employed during his playing career and beyond.
Here are some power takeaways from today’s conversation:
[02:00] Dedication to basketball and daily practice
[07:58] The impact of expectations on performance and personal growth
[16:00] From small-town Missouri to the NBA
[25:00] Developing a daily routine of improvement
[31:00] Investing in real estate early and often
[46:00] Choosing cash flow investments over traditional returns 
[1:00:30] Learning valuable lessons from setbacks and mistakes 
[1:12:00] Finding fulfillment through philanthropic work 
 
Episode Highlights:
[07:58] The Impact of Expectations on Performance and Personal Growth
Anthony had intuitively developed this growth mentality from a very young age. He discussed always thinking ahead towards his future goals and recognizing the importance of small, daily efforts to steadily progress over time towards his dream of making the NBA through a process of self-directed learning and ownership of his development. From a young age, Anthony developed a daily routine of getting his shots up and working on his game for 20 minutes each day. He shares how this consistent practice built up over time through the 10,000 hour rule and helped him improve his skills.
[31:00] Investing in Real Estate and Maximizing Investment Returns
Anthony got started in real estate right after college with his first investment property and he has invested in some private businesses and deals over the years, including a highly successful currency trading portfolio. In recent years, he has shifted his investment focus more towards cash flow generating deals and opportunities that provide monthly or quarterly returns. Some of his alternative investments, like his highly successful currency trading portfolio, have significantly outperformed his traditional stock market investments in terms of returns. Anthony actively seeks out opportunities outside more conventional avenues in order to generate higher returns for his portfolio. It's an example of how he thinks unconventionally when it comes to maximizing his investment returns.
[1:00:30] Learning Valuable Lessons from Setbacks and MistakesAnthony shares the hardest financial lesson of his career when an investment in a friend's business went sour. As a result, he learned to improve on due diligence and bringing in outside help to manage opportunities going forward.
[1:12:00] Finding Fulfillment through Philanthropic Work Anthony shares his involvement with the nonprofit organization World Serve International, where he is a board co-chair. Doing mission trips to Africa with his wife, Anthony stresses the importance of having a cause greater than himself to contribute to through initiatives focused on clean water, education, and community empowerment.
Resources Mentioned:
Anthony Tolliver's Twitter: https://twitter.com/ATolliver44
Creighton University basketball: https://gocreighton.com/sports/mens-basketball
World Serve International nonprofit: https://www.worldserve.org/

E09: Undeniable: Rennie Curran’s Story of Resilience, Faith, and Success On and Off the Field

Kris Benson and Alec Ogletree welcome former NFL linebacker Rennie Curran this week. After a standout college career at the University of Georgia where he led the SEC in tackles, Rennie's NFL journey was anything but easy as he faced constant doubts about his size and struggled to stick with teams. However, through it all, he found the motivation to focus on his transition during his playing career and set himself up for success beyond the game.
Here are some power takeaways from today’s conversation:
[00:38] - Leading the SEC in tackling his junior year at UGA
[10:07] - Training with former NFL players to earn a starting role at UGA 
[11:58] - Overcoming doubt by becoming undeniable
[13:23] - Operating in faith, not circumstances
[24:47] - Handling finances as an athlete
[30:28] - Carrying the weight of being the “first generation” to make it big
[34:50] - Financial management and saying no to requests
[47:00] - Finding yourself in times of transition
 
Episode Highlights:
[11:58] Overcoming Doubt by Becoming Undeniable
Rennie details the constant doubts he faced about his size throughout his career and how he was continually told he was "too short" to play linebacker. However, he found motivation in proving people wrong and leaving it all on the field whenever he stepped onto the field. While people questioned the coaches' decision to offer him a role due to his size, Rennie made himself "undeniable" through his elite effort and production on the field. His relentless work ethic and refusal to be deterred by doubts allowed him to earn significant playing time and go on to have an All-American career at UGA.
[13:23] Operating in Faith, Not Circumstances
Rennie explains that operating in faith meant performing at the level of his vision and goals, not where his current situation may be. By operating according to his vision and ambitions rather than letting doubts or circumstances discourage him, he was always prepared to seize opportunities when they arose. His relentless work ethic and belief in himself despite obstacles set him up for great success despite constant questions about his physical tools. 
[17:09] Harnessing Athletic Resilience for Entrepreneurial Success
Reflecting on his athletic past, Rennie acknowledges the ingrained traits of dedication, discipline, and delayed gratification that have shaped him. His sports career didn't always yield immediate rewards, yet it fostered resilience and perseverance that he now channels into his entrepreneurial journey. He advocates for athletes to pinpoint their key strengths from their sporting days and integrate them into their present endeavors, a practice that aids in preserving their core identity post their athletic careers. Rennie's transition from an athlete to an entrepreneur underscores the profound understanding that the fruits of hard work, albeit unexpected at times, hold immense value.
[47:00] Finding Yourself in Times of Transition
Rennie equates life-altering events like losing a business or going through a divorce to being a 'free agent'. These periods of uncertainty and transition, he suggests, are opportunities for self-discovery and growth. Drawing from his own experiences, he advocates for resilience and adaptability, using challenges as catalysts for introspection and reinvention. 
Resources Mentioned:
www.renniecurran.com 

E08: Wildcat to Wealth Manager: Ronnie Brown’s Path After the NFL

This week, Kris Benson and Alec Ogletree sit down with NFL legend Ronnie Brown to discuss his incredible journey from pioneering the "Wildcat" formation in the league to reinventing himself as a financial advisor after retiring from football.
Here are some power takeaways from today’s conversation:
[00:00] Introduction
[06:30] How the Wildcat offense originated for the Dolphins
[12:15] Ronnie's draft experience, being selected 2nd overall by Miami
[21:00] Challenges of managing finances as a young player with little guidance
[31:09] The business of self
[33:50] Transitioning to a new career path post-NFL without a traditional finance background
[47:30] Ronnie's process of obtaining Series 7 and 66 licenses in a compressed timeline
[59:15] Lessons learned around protecting assets and avoiding risky investments
Episode Highlights:
[18:51] Don’t Let Yourself Get Too Comfortable
One of the most valuable lessons Ronnie learned both during his NFL career, and after, is the importance of not letting yourself get too comfortable. As a young player coming into big money for the first time, Ronnie was wary of settling into complacency. He shares how he avoided flashy purchases or extravagant lifestyles early on in order to stay hungry and focused on continuing to improve on the field.
[28:32] Success Leaves Clues
As a young player, Ronnie sought to identify veterans in the locker room who had achieved sustained success and model his habits and work ethic after them. Later in his transition to financial advising, Ronnie realized he needed to find mentors who had successfully navigated similar career changes and learn from their experiences. The insight and guidance he received from established advisors who welcomed him in, proved invaluable as he pursued his licenses and built his practice. Ronnie continues to pay this wisdom forward by mentoring both current and former athletes. He emphasizes how taking time to observe those who have achieved what you want is key to accelerating your own path to success. By studying the clues left behind, you can avoid unnecessary mistakes and position yourself for breakthroughs more quickly.
[31:09] Becoming the CEO of Your Business
Ronnie realized that as an NFL player, you essentially become the CEO of your own personal business, with all the responsibilities that entails. From managing your finances and brand partnerships to scheduling workouts and hiring advisors, athletes must quickly adopt an entrepreneurial mindset. Ronnie admits he wasn't prepared for this change as a young player. However, it drove him to educate himself more on topics like contract negotiations, sponsorship opportunities, and long-term career planning. He encourages current athletes to view themselves not just as employees of their team, but as CEOs who need to make strategic decisions to protect their assets and set themselves up for success beyond their playing days. 
[59:15] Lessons Learned Around Asset Preservation
Ronnie emphasizes doing thorough research on any investment opportunities that come your way. As an athlete, it's easy to be targeted by shady individuals looking to profit off your fame and money. He also encourages diversifying assets across multiple stable sectors rather than putting all your eggs in one risky basket. Above all, Ronnie stresses patience and avoiding get-rich-quick schemes. His advice is to focus first on understanding how to grow wealth modestly over the long-term through low-fee index funds and real estate before venturing into more complex deals. Protecting the money you've earned is as important as earning it, according to the lessons Ronnie has learned.
Resources Mentioned:
Follow Ronnie on IG: @ronnie23brown

E07: Changing Uniforms, Changing Careers: Matt Capps on Transitioning From Pro Athlete to Businessman

Kris Benson and Alec Ogletree sit down with former MLB pitcher Matt Capps for a candid conversation about transitioning to life after professional sports. Over the course of his seven-year MLB career, Matt played for the Pittsburgh Pirates, Minnesota Twins, and Cleveland Indians before retiring in 2016. In this episode, Matt shares lessons learned from his baseball career and discusses his new ventures in real estate development.
Here are some power takeaways from today’s conversation:
[00:00]
[02:28] Baseball memories and childhood experiences
[16:19] Baseball draft experience and signing bonus
[19:36] Matt’s perception of money
[22:51] Minor league baseball pay and contracts
[28:44] Baseball career path and promotion to the majors
[38:44] Baseball finances and pension planning
[42:56] Follow the money
[44:51] The power of leveraging relationships
[54:14] The importance of doing due diligence
[1:09:50] Business and personal growth after 40
[1:15:36] Getting to know your financial plan even during the season
[1:16:51] The power of ask
 
Episode Highlights:
[42:56] Follow the Money
Matt discusses an important lesson he learned about following incentives when it comes to financial advice. He explains that early in his investing career, his financial advisor steered him away from real estate investments. However, looking back, Matt realizes that the advisor did not have expertise or ways to profit from real estate deals. So when the advisor discouraged real estate, it was actually because they couldn't directly benefit or collect fees from those types of investments. Matt came to understand that when a financial professional advises against an asset class they can't control or profit from, it may be due to misaligned incentives rather than objective financial guidance. This was an "aha" moment for Matt about following the money and incentives when receiving investment recommendations.
[44:51] The Power of Leveraging Relationships
Matt’s involvement in a large-scale real estate development project in Huntsville, Alabama came about through connecting with the right people in his network. He details how a chance meeting with a friend of a friend, who was an experienced developer, led to a partnership opportunity on a $62 million apartment complex project. This relationship allowed him to gain expertise from industry professionals while also participating in a major deal. Even small initial interactions, like agreeing to have a casual lunch, may ultimately result in high-impact collaborations and opportunities if you make the effort to nurture your relationships over time.
[54:14] The Importance of Doing Due Diligence
Matt discusses the importance of conducting due diligence even on smaller real estate deals. Buying his first medical office building with a partner, he notes that despite it being a relatively small investment, he still insisted on visiting the property in person to verify the details before committing funds. While his partners simply wanted to move forward based on the financials, he took the time to inspect the HVAC systems, talk to tenants, and ensure the asset matched the description. His extra diligence helped avoid any potential issues down the line. Taking the time for due diligence can help mitigate risks and give investors greater peace of mind, even on more modest real estate plays.
Resources Mentioned:
Reliant Real Estate Management
Follow Matt Capps on X: @mattcapps55

E06: Dominique Easley’s Journey to Financial Mastery

Beyond The Game Wealth Mastery welcomes former NFL defensive lineman Dominique Easley as this week's guest. Over his five year NFL career, Dominique played for the New England Patriots and Los Angeles Rams, winning a Super Bowl in 2015. Since retiring from professional football, Dominique has dedicated his efforts to real estate investing. He currently owns rental properties in New York and partners with local contractors on house flipping projects in Atlanta. 
Today, Dominique is eager to share both the triumphs and tribulations from his NFL career, as well as the valuable financial lessons he has learned along his journey so far. Listen in to gain insight into his path of wealth creation – both on and off the football field.
Here are some power takeaways from today’s conversation:
[00:00] Introduction
[07:54] High school football, recruitment, and college major choices
[16:47] Overcoming knee injuries
[18:24] An interest in farming
[26:33] Sports career setbacks and financial decisions
[30:26] From NFL stardom to real estate regrets
[34:46} The importance of prioritizing mental health
[47:25] Dominique’s real estate investments
[51:17] Real estate investing and partnerships in Atlanta
[55:42] Tips for finding the right partner to work with
 
Episode Highlights:
[26:33] Lessons from Early NFL Career
Dominique  got candid about some of the personal challenges he faced early on in his NFL career. He spoke openly about battling mental health issues as he adjusted to life in the league. This took a toll on him and affected his decision-making. Financially, Dominique shared that he did not properly manage his earnings or have the right guidance in place. One costly mistake was paying $100,000 for a vehicle, only to have it later stolen when he irresponsibly leased it out. Over time and through experience, Dominique learned crucial lessons about prioritizing his mental wellness and putting structures in place for his finances. He emphasized that finding mentors to advise him on these aspects of his life after football was instrumental in getting him on the right path.
[34:46] The Importance of Prioritizing Mental Health
Proper mental healthcare is crucial for athletes balancing intense physical demands, injuries, loneliness on the road, and the spotlight of fame/success. Left unaddressed, mental health issues can negatively impact decision-making, relationships, and physical health. Dominique's experience shows that seeking help is not a sign of weakness, but rather a sign of strength and commitment to long-term well-being. Mental health should be treated with the same importance as physical health for athletes. Having support systems and professionals to help navigate challenges can optimize careers and financial success, in addition to overall quality of life. 
[55:42] Tips for Finding the Right Partner
When asked about advice for finding the right partners, Dominique emphasized the importance of trust. He said "If I can't leave you in my home with my children, I do not want to do business with you." He wants to make sure potential partners are people he feels completely comfortable and safe with. He also looks at a partner's work ethic and track record. For his real estate deals, he partners with people who have years of experience and have already successfully flipped dozens of homes. Doing due diligence on a partner's background and qualifications helps ensure they are reliable and competent to collaborate with on investments.
Resources Mentioned:
Book: Die With Zero

E05: Building a Successful Business in Sports Training with Coach Lily Abdelmalek

Discover how to leverage your time in sports to create opportunities for future growth and unlock your full potential. In this episode, Kris Benson and Alec Ogletree sit down with speed and agility coach Lily Abdelmalek to discuss her journey building her own training business, DSA Training. 
Lily shares how she got her start training some of the biggest names in football like Alec Ogletree and Takeo Spikes. She also opens up about the challenges of being a female entrepreneur in a male-dominated industry. Whether you're an aspiring athlete or embarking on a new career path, Lily's insights will inspire you to think bigger and master the art of wealth creation on and off the field.
Here are some power takeaways from today’s conversation:
[00:00] - Introduction
[06:52] - Lily’s athletic training background
[10:06] - Her career path in sports training
[17:20] - How she started her own business
[23:39] - Recognizing the growth cycle
[33:04] - Managing a gym business with a focus on growth and real estate investment
[35:59] - The power of versatility: Lily's journey in training athletes
[45:40] - Gaining respect in a male-dominated field
[53:36] - Athlete financial planning and retirement
Episode Highlights:
[08:13] Lily’s Career Path in Sports Training
Lily's unconventional journey into sports training began with casual sports participation in her youth and a college education focused on physiology and kinesiology. An internship in Atlanta exposed her to the field and working with high-performing athletes. After training under Olympic coach Tony Villani, Lily decided to start her own business, DSA Training. Starting small, she gradually built her clientele through word-of-mouth and overcame the challenges of being a female entrepreneur. Today, she owns a 15,000 sq. ft. facility and leads a team that serves hundreds of athletes each season.
[23:39] Recognizing the Growth Cycle
In her fourth year in her current space, Lily reflects on her journey and acknowledges the lessons learned along the way. Hindsight has shown her areas where she would have made different choices, but she understands that these experiences have provided valuable knowledge for the future. She recognizes that this cycle of growth and learning will continue as she continues to push forward in her pursuit of success in sports training.
[35:59] The Power of Versatility: Lily's Journey in Training Athletes
Lily's experience in the sports training business has taught her the importance of versatility. Instead of focusing solely on one specific area, like speed and agility for receivers, she has tapped into a broader market. By working with athletes across different sports, from baseball to football to soccer, she ensures a steady stream of clients throughout the year. This flexibility not only allows her to cater to a wider range of athletes but also provides financial stability. While specializing in one area may seem appealing, Lily understands the need to broaden horizons and adapt to different athletic needs. By doing so, she has been able to establish herself as a trusted trainer who can effectively train athletes from various disciplines.
[54:29] Beyond the Field: Maximizing Football as a Resource in the Journey
In Lily's experience, football has served as more than just a game. It has become a valuable resource that sets athletes up for their future endeavors. She emphasizes the importance of helping players understand this aspect, as many tend to get lost in the identity of being solely a football player. Lily reminds them that their football career will eventually come to an end, usually by the time they reach their late 30s or 40s. Instead, she encourages them to view football as a stepping stone, a vital part of their journey, but not the sole source of income. 
Resources Mentioned:
www.dsa-training.com 
Instagram: @lilydsatraining

E04: From Practice Squad to Property Flips: Mack Brown’s Path to Financial Success

In this episode Kris Benson and Alec Ogletree chat with former NFL player turned real estate investor Mack Brown. Mack spent five years in the NFL, playing for the Washington Redskins and Oakland Raiders. After his NFL career, he pursued real estate investing by flipping houses. He has since gone back to school to earn his MBA and is now working towards his PhD in organizational management with a focus on leadership.
Here are some power takeaways from today’s conversation:
The importance of growth mindset
The value of financial education
Investing in personal growth
Mack’s experience recovering from the injury
Episode Highlights:
[13:52] The Importance of a Growth Mindset
Having a strong work ethic and mentality of always improving yourself is important for success both on and off the field. Mack discussed always working to better himself even when facing obstacles. Even when facing obstacles like injuries or not playing much in college, Mack maintained a relentless dedication to his training and development. He discussed how he would work out every day, even after games when his teammates were socializing, in order to prepare himself for opportunities in the NFL. This mentality of grinding through challenges and never being satisfied helped propel Mack to a five-year NFL career despite going undrafted. His willingness to always get better served him well beyond football too. When injuries ended his playing days, Mack applied this growth mindset to pivoting his career path and education. His story demonstrates that having a focus on self-improvement will help one overcome setbacks and achieve their goals both on and off the field.
[31:00] The Value of Financial Education
Having a financial plan and education is crucial, as the NFL money doesn't last long if not managed properly. Never be afraid to pivot to new opportunities and invest in further education. Mack didn't have financial literacy growing up and wishes he invested during his playing days. After injuries ended Mack's career, he pursued real estate investing and went back to school to set himself up for long term success.
[52:31] Investing in Personal Growth
While he has found success in flipping houses, Mack recognizes the importance of working for a top multifamily developer to truly master the industry. By taking a job, even if only for a few years, he can gain an "education on someone else's dime." Working with a leading multifamily company allows him to absorb best practices, forge valuable industry connections, and minimize risk before launching his own projects. Apprenticing under successful companies accelerates his learning curve, and Mack believes the opportunity costs are well worth it to ultimately pursue his own ventures with heightened expertise and confidence. His recommendation emphasizes the significance of continuous investment in personal growth, even after achieving initial success.
Resources Mentioned:
Shoe Dog

E03: Mastering Wealth Creation: An Interview with Georgia Legend Kevin Minter

In this episode, Kris Benson and Alec Ogletree sit down with Kevin Minter, a nine-year NFL veteran who won a Super Bowl with the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. Kevin understands both the sacrifices of a professional athletic career and the importance of planning for life after sports. 
Kevin provides valuable lessons for professional athletes on building financial security. Through real estate flipping ventures gone wrong and conservative stock investments that left money on the table, Minter learned that aggressively yet intelligently pursuing alternative asset classes like private equity deals and syndicated real estate funds providing recurring cash flow are optimal for wealth generation over the long run compared to traditional savings and markets alone. His experience highlights the importance of proactively educating yourself on diverse investment vehicles and having advisors who can help unlock opportunities beyond conventional means.
Here are some power takeaways from today’s conversation:
College football, draft, and financial planning
The importance of hiring a financial advisor for NFL players
What he bought with his first check
Kevin’s investment portfolio
Episode Highlights:
[15:30] The Importance of Hiring a Financial Advisor for NFL Players
Quality financial guidance is important for helping players make informed investment decisions. Kevin wished he understood his finances earlier rather than just saving, and an advisor could have helped with this. His brother also provided crucial guidance that many players lack. He initially invested only in stocks and bonds through his advisor, rather than wealth-generating deals an advisor may have guided him towards earlier. An advisor can also help set up players for financial success after their career. Kevin wanted to retire on his terms given football's physical toll, but needed investments generating cash flow. NFL contracts have complex tax implications that are difficult to navigate without expert financial and tax advice. Financial advisors are invaluable partners for NFL players due to the outsized money management responsibilities during a brief career window.
[32:34] Investing in The Joint Chiropractic
One of Kevin Minter's early real estate investments involved becoming a regional developer for The Joint, a national chiropractic franchise, which allowed him to open multiple clinic locations across a region and generate passive income without direct operations involvement. As a low-overhead business with recurring subscription revenue and aided by Minter's celebrity endorsement, this chiropractic investment proved a more hands-off and lucrative opportunity than his previous property flipping ventures.
[40:36] Kevin’s Investment Portfolio
In the early stages of his real estate investing career, Kevin owned single-family rental homes in the Atlanta area which he would purchase and re-sell, however he found that being directly involved in contracting and property management was difficult and not very passive. This experience led him to realize that multifamily properties and syndicated real estate funds which involved larger portfolios of units across multiple properties provided a more hands-off investment model with greater income potential. His investment portfolio now includes syndicated real estate funds that own multifamily properties which provide steady cash flow from rental income, as well as dividend paying stocks and bonds for stability. This approach demonstrates his philosophy of making money work for him through diversified low-maintenance holdings that do not require direct management and can support his desired lifestyle even after retiring from football.
Resources Mentioned:
The Joint Chiropractic
Rich Dad Poor Dad